User talk:JSpuller

Corrections

• For update
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  Sforza lion update, similar to lions of Norway posture. example 1, example 2

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  On this one IMO only the quince should be updated as it seems that Pesaro branch actually used the variant of Sforza arms with the quince with shorter stalk. So the lion should maintain the posture.

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  Same as previous

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  Dudley lion update

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  Dudley lion

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  Dudley lion

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  Dudley lion

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  Dudley lion

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  Dudley lion

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  The double tailed lion here is that of Welles family

New Arms requests

Illeshazy or rather Illésházy - Barons and counts. Their arms shows a blue shield with a black eagle being pierced by an arrow, the stance of the eagle (or hawk?) is somewhat different on some variants regarding the fact is it being pierced or also holding an arrow in its beak. First variant examples: example 1, example 2, example 3., example 4. However I believe this variant is actually just a simple variant of how the arms is really supposed to look which is shown in far more prevalent variant which shows the eagle having a bit of a different stance: example 1, example 2, example 3, example 4, example 5, example 6, example 7, example 8, example 9, etc, etc.

Stolberg Wertheim - great arms of Louis of Stolberg, Count of Stolberg and Wetheim. He had bunch of arms, this one is the great arms variant, others are uploaded. Example seen here. This arms is basically a merger between this arms and this arms

Stolberg-Wernigerode Princes - senior branch of Stolberg family, arms as Princes. As previous it's a hybrid of previous arms and some elements used also in Schwarzburg arms. example 1

Cavalcabo - Lords of Cremona, Marquises of Viadana. Branch of the famed Obertenghi family, later known as Welf or Welf-Este. The arms is a knight riding a bull. example 1, example 2, example 3, example 4, etc.

Twisleton - Family of Twisleton and later of Barlow Hall in Yorkshire. The arms is argent, three moles between a chevron sable. example

Twisleton-Fiennes - arms as successors of Fiennes family and Barons of Saye and Sele. Arms is quartered arms of Fiennes and above mentioned Twisleton. example

Graeff - old arms of the family. friendly request to upload some more images: I) earlier coat of arms (end of the 16th century as Lords of Valkenburg, Netherlands)- shown figures are a shovel and a falcon - template see here [1] ---- II) oldest known coat of arms, first reported in 1543 as patricians of Amsterdam - shown figures are a shovel and swan - template see here [2] ------ III) coat of arms variant 17th century as Lords of Valkenburg - shown figures are a shovel and a falcon - template see here [3]--- thanks in advance

Comment

Btw have you checked the files I recently uploaded? It's a bunch...they are all plain/regular svg files, some went through illustrator. I am still having issues with editing illustrator files in inkscape and saving them, a trash additional name code appears every time so it's a hassle to fix is every time for every single file...hopefully these new files are fine, I've loaded most of them in illustrator and all seems fine, but that is on my part... Finellach (talk) 00:12, 17 March 2021 (CET)

They seem to be better but some arms still get "corrupted" meaning that the lines/strokes get exported to svg elements. I'll upload those arms again. However I'm starting to think that it's better that you don't edit "my" arms, at least for now. JSpuller (talk) 10:13, 20 March 2021 (CET)

Ok, I suggest you do something...take one of the files edited/made in illustrator and edit them in inkscape, doesn't have to be anything big, change the tincture or nothing at all even f.e., then just save it...now try to upload that file here and tell me what you get? When you try to do that you will understand what the problem is. The way I am circumventing this sometimes is by cutting the entire arms and pasting it on a empty file/canvass. Because there is no other way for me to go around this issue. This is the same problem I am having for almost 3 years now, maybe more. I never had any issue before that nor did you with my files, but since then it is a problem. So while it is true inkscape and illustrator have an issue by illustrator having ridiculous naming codes and inkscape butchering them, such svg file in general is just fine, it is the wikimedia client version here that makes it a big issue as it does not allow you to upload such edited file. I've looked around and there seems to be a patch since 2016 for this... Finellach (talk) 22:06, 22 March 2021 (CET)

Please don't delete the so-called "Or variants", yes all those prior to 14th century are attributed, we know this...we talked about it way way before. I was planning on doing a separate page with all the "Or variants" (attributed and otherwise) but I just don't have time...I still need to fix Croy family and bunch of other families, they are a complete mess right now...at least I fixed some major families such as Habsburgs and Welf-Brunswick, etc. Only on Habsburgs I literally spent days just researching and putting a proper setup....can't do it all on my own lol...don't have 10 hands and 5 heads... Finellach (talk) 15:26, 19 March 2021 (CET)

Those Or variants were made up by Arnaud Bunel for his site, Heraldique Europennee . I honestly don't see why they should be used on the site. JSpuller (talk) 19:20, 19 March 2021 (CET)

Those attributed "or variants" were around long before he started his website. He was just copying what others did which often resulted in erroneous versions of the arms. The reason why I want them on the site is because of certain continuity, since as I said, I want to make a separate section with just "or variants". Plus we have bunch of other far more dubious attributed arms (these are literally their proper arms impaled on the imperial eagle) so why not have these as well? And as I said I plan to link them and mark them appropriately as attributed. The only problem is, as I said, is that I cannot catch a break to do the HRE page as I want to (I was also planning to do a page with imperial offices as well) since I am trying to repair and fix pages, some of which were messed up by me in the past... I mean it may seem sometimes like I am not doing anything but trust me I am constantly doing something, either researching or putting together setups to correct some of these family pages. Finellach (talk) 21:47, 19 March 2021 (CET)

Yes, but these arms doesn't appear in any historical sources. they are more presumed than attributed. But go ahead and use them, but rather not on the HRE page. Feel free to let me know which the more dubious attributed arms are, I am focusing more on research at the moment. JSpuller (talk) 22:12, 19 March 2021 (CET)

Majority of those "or variants" don't appear in any historical sources either and are at best (even if they do exist) variants of the actual arms. Now the HRE page (as it was) looked like a collection of "or variants", attributed or not, now it looks mangled and mixed up. If I was a neutral observed I would not understand what we are trying to achieve there. The page should be either "or variants" or none at all or both (in two separate sections), otherwise makes little sense as it is now. Finellach (talk) 22:06, 22 March 2021 (CET)