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User talk:JSpuller


New Arms requests

Manuel I - Joint arms of Manuel I of Portugal and his queen-consort Maria of Aragon. I have already made a similar arms which has less castles than the source image so whichever you choose, 8 is more than enough since I believe the castle is just an artistic expression by the author. The arms in question is a cross between Portugal and arms of Maria of Aragon. The half shield of Portugal is from Saxe-Coburg-Gotha arms.
Lago - Arms of Lago - no need for elaboration, the image pretty much speaks for itself
Ornelas - Arms of Ornelas shows shield azure, bend gules with three gold lillies, on each side a siren holding a comb and a mirror
Gil Vantvisyet - Livro image, quartered Or and Azure, not sure what those things are in 1st and 4th quarter but it sure looks like some kind of shoes. 2nd and 3rd quarter a moor's head, over all a cross gules hollow argent
Pachecho Livro - source image. The arms of Pachecho in Livro seems like a hybrid of several cauldron variants we have: Pachecho, Manrique de Lara, Lara Ancient. The elements on the cauldron seem to be vaire nebuly similar to Vasconcelos f.e.
Afonso Garces - Again the source image is pretty straightforward, complicated but clear.
Gabriel Goncalves - source image. Arms is double-headed eagle holding a moor's head, all withing a "rope bordure" similar to Eca i.e. Eça arms.
Bairros Livro - source image. The Livro image shows three branches throughout the arms as opposed to Bairros proper which shows just three plain branches. In Livro branches are literally like three bends
Abul - source image - shield split in two. First half shows an imperial eagle like in the arms of Charlemagne, the other half is azure with a fess gules, fess gules charged with crescent argent, below fess two crescents gules.
Duarte Brandao - source image, shows two dragons Or, intertwined. The dragons/serpents are the same as in Serpa arms for example
Botos - source image shows a shield divided per saltire Or and gules, Or quarters charged with a Moor's head, gules quarters charged with argent towers
Viveiro - source image shows a shield quartered. 1st and 4th quarter are similar to Guzman or Manrique de Lara cauldorns (not so many serpent heads), cauldrons are completely chequy argent and gules on a azure field, bordure ermine. 1st and 3rd quarter are a variant of Fajardo quarters, water part seems smaller on this variant than on the example linked, while the branches are intertwined in a saltire.

Iturbide - source example Arms as Princes of Iturbide, prior to that with no escutcheon, noble family from Navarre ennobled in 15th century by John II of Aragon, perpetual mayors/magistrates (Alcaide) of Batzan Valley, moved to "New Spain" (Mexico) in 17th century
Augustin de Iturbide arms as Emperor of Mexico 1822-1823
Maximilian I of Mexico - Arms as Emperor. Born as Ferdinand Maximilian Joseph von Habsburg, younger brother of Franz Joseph I of Austria.

Canton of Glarus - Glarus is ususally depicted as a monk, although the exact compositions vary. Similar to the monks in Zurich Roll 4. Sources and examples of Glaurus arms: wikipedia page about the arms, example1, heraldry of the world page
Duchy of Zara - Duchy of Zara located at city of Zara or Zadar. The only coat of arms missing to complete the Austrian Empire page. The arms show Saint Chrysogonus on a horse. This arms has been also described in Arthur Charles Fox-Davies' book of public arms where he describes it as "argent, a mounted knight in full armor, his lance in pale, all proper" and shows an illustration. Current civic arms and dating back to early 20th century also draw directly from the historical arms that was eventually now modern arms of the city and also of the duchy in Austrian Empire. The best way to describe how I feel the shield should look is that it should be f.e. same as Vilnius but the position of the arms and lance correct, and also the rider would not have a helmet but a halo...also would carry a shield in the same manner which would be "argent, cross gules" i.e. as Genoa arms f.e. Colors of the shield in general would be argent, horde sable...adorned gold and red, rider's armor full gold. An example of the rider. I'll probably make an example just show what I mean.

Wallenstein Imperial - arms of Wallenstein/Waldstein somewhere after 1628-1632 when they became Reichsgrafen of the empire i.e. imperial counts Waldstein/Wallenstein. The arms were same as earlier quartered arms of Moravian branch but the difference is the lions became two-tailed and here is also an escutcheon added in a circular shape as on Laskaris arms or the few arms we have in Translyvnia page....the escutcheon has a wreath of leaves around it though. The escutcheon is: argent, imperial eagle sable holding an anchor Or in it's right claw (left from our PoV) and olive branch in its left, above the eagle imperial crown and on the chest of the eagle in gold initials "F I.I.". example on page 13

Wallenstein-Wartenberg - in 1758 they were allowed to be named "Wallenstein-Wartenberg" i.e. Imperial Counts Waldstein/Wallenstein and Lords of Wartenberg. The arms is the same as the above except lions are now also crowned and two more smaller escutcheons were added above and below the middle escutcheon, showing the arms of Wartenberg (see Bethlen arms with a middle escutcheon). Example on page 15.

Rossiter - Anglo-Norman barons in Ireland. Originally from Normandy, went to England with William the Conqueror and then went to Ireland where they remained ever since. They were some of the most powerful Anglo-Norman barons in Ireland and held large swaths of land in Wexford, namely Barony of Forth and Bargy, their main seat being Rathmacknee Castle. Their CoA is really unique...it is: argent, an alligator vert. Examples: example 1, example 2, example 3. This CoA reminded me of the arms city of Nimes has.

Dalzell - Lords Dalzell and Earls of Carnwath. Their arms is most peculiar, being: sable, a naked man proper with hands extended on the side. example
Dalzell Glenae - Baronets of Glenae, cadets of the above being descended from a younger brother of the 1st Lord Dalzell. Same arms withing a bordure argent: example
Dalyell - Baronets of Binns. Different spelling, same family. This is a cadet branch descended from the uncle of the 1st Lord Dalzell. Same arms with a canton argent charged with a pistol and sabre (sword): example
Menteith-Dalyell - Matrilineal branch of the above. This is in fact family that married a heiress and adopted the name of previous Baronets (as was quite common). The family is paternally House Stewart of Menteith, specifically of the Auldcathie. Their arms was quartering Dallyel and Menteith. There are variants how the buckles are set on 1st and 4th quarter of Menteith, sometimes two above and vice versa...I guess depending on what it looks more aesthetically better.
Vane - Barons Barnards, Lords of Raby Castle, Earls of Darlington and Dukes of Cleveland. This is the cadet branch of Fane who were Earls of Westmorland from early 17th century and still holding the earldom. The arms of Fane is three golden gauntlets affrontée while the arms of Vane are same arms only reversed i.e. gauntles appaumée. So the Vane shows gauntlets i.e. open armed arms, while the Fane shows back of the armed hand. example.

I will start working on your request, just don't expect them to be completed that quick. :)

From 'Some Feudal Coat of Arms', https://archive.org/stream/somefeudalcoatso00fostrich#page/n6/mode/2up Fane, John (Vane), of Hilden, Kent (H. VI.) bore, azure, three dexter gauntlets or. Shirley.] F.


Btw. I updated the pierced stars on recently uploaded Awsthwaite and couple other arms (Balliol and Jardine)...I think you made a mistake when you were updating the said Awsthwaite arms from normal stars to six-pointed stars and the pierced part remained from normal stars (which is a bit smaller) and now translated into Balliol/Jardine recent update....at least I hope so...because there are literally dozens of arms with these pierced stars going back since the beginning and changing them all to have a different pierced part ratio compared to the star would be a huge waste of time IMO...especially since the old standard six-pointed pierced stars with bigger pierced part look so much better....please... ;) Finellach (talk) 19:10, 9 February 2019 (UTC) Edit: Also forgot to mention...I went and updated all the lions on chief (both passant and guardant) per recent update...as you can see ofc on the upload page.

I took the liberty and updated/modified all the quartered three bars arms we have. I don't know how and why but there are two variants on the site with one which was symmetrical as all other arms with lines and one which was dominant in three bars quartered arms where the lowers bars were bigger and really stuck out once you notice it. Somehow I didn't notice that until recently and it looked really strange to me...my OCD was triggered. :p I think the arms look much better when they are symmetrical and they are now also in general line with how other quartered arms with bars are (those with two f.e.). Hope you're fine with it, if not revert but I think it's an improvement. Regards. Edit: Forgot to add...the arms of Sotomayor (Souto Maior) are in fact gemelles chequy on black bars. Apparently their arms is in fact a fusion of Mesia and Cisneros with chequy gemelles taken from Cisneros arms and black bars are those of Mesia...how the latter became sable instead of azure is unknown to me...but thats the official story. Finellach (talk) 20:48, 12 February 2019 (UTC)

That is much appreciated, thank you Finellach! I wish I had the same control of things as you, JSpuller (talk) 09:19, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

Can I make a suggestion (I know, I know, another one) ? I think it would be better to use the usual coded format (naming & numbering) for roll of arms rather than having the full names (like Wijnbergen). One clear advantage of such a system is that it doesn't pollute the search feature as much as how we are doing things right now (can't search for "berg" anymore, I've made sure to ruin that one with the Wijnbergen lol). I realize it's too late for the existing rolls but the future ones could use a simple code we've agreed on. As an example, item number 86 in the Herald's roll would be named FW86_Atholl.svg instead of Heralds_Roll_86_Atholl.svg (that's the code I use myself, FW being for FitzWilliam - the only edition available online - hardly original since all other databases use the same format).--Solo (talk) 14:46, 15 February 2019 (UTC)

This sounds like a good idea, let's go with that. I agree that the search function is a bit ruined at the moment... :P JSpuller (talk) 09:23, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

Regarding the arms/flag of Serbian empire I would say it is almost certain the background is yellow, not white. You can actually see the entire map here and if you compare it to the nearby flag/arms of the Angevin kings of Hungary and Croatia who quartered gold lilies with Arpad white and red lines you can actually see that the background of the eagle is identical to the shade of the golden/yellow lilies while the white Arpad stripes are much more brighter....same with all other flags/arms that have white/yellow color...it's is much brighter shade. As for yellow, you can compare it to the Hohenstaufen arms that is three black lions on yellow, again same identical shade as on Nemanjic flag. Also it would make sense that Dushan would adopt more similar color scheme (inverted imperial eagle colors actually) as he was in fact claiming to be "Emperor of Greeks", it was only later that he fully adopted the title "Emperor of Greeks and Serbs", in essence he was trying to usurp the title of the Byzantine Emperor rather than organize a new empire...it is only in retrospect that we call his state "Serbian Empire" when in reality it was usurpation of the imperial power. Finellach (talk) 08:30, 17 February 2019 (UTC)

Ok, that sounds fair, lets stick with the "yellow" version then. :) JSpuller (talk) 09:21, 19 February 2019 (UTC)