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PO377 Ralph Spigurnel.svg|377. Ralph Spigurnel<br><span style="font-size:88%; line-height: 1.3em;">Lord of Headbourne Worthy and Bromsgrove<br>''sr rad spigornel''</span>
PO377 Ralph Spigurnel.svg|377. Ralph Spigurnel<br><span style="font-size:88%; line-height: 1.3em;">Lord of Headbourne Worthy and Bromsgrove<br>''sr rad spigornel''</span>
PO378 John de Colville.svg|378. John de Colville<br><span style="font-size:88%; line-height: 1.3em;">Lord of Swinstead<br>''sr jon coleuyle''</span>
PO378 John de Colville.svg|378. John de Colville<br><span style="font-size:88%; line-height: 1.3em;">Lord of Swinstead<br>''sr jon coleuyle''</span>
Blount-Croke.svg|379. William le Blount<br><span style="font-size:88%; line-height: 1.3em;">Lord of Belton<br>''sr will blount''</span><!-- This arms is most likely a mix-up, the Blount family always used barry nebulee of six pieces Or and Sable. This William according to most sources would be William le Blount, 2nd Lord Blount. His brother Nicholas was in fact the one who fled to Italy then later returned to England and changed his surname to "Croke" and his descendants used this arms. There seems to be a general confusion in Blount genealogy. Arms seems to be similar to a Beauchamp branch but sources mostly mention that certain other William Blount (of Sodington branch) married a daughter of Beauchamp...all in all total confusion here -->
Blount-Croke.svg|379. William le Blount<br><span style="font-size:88%; line-height: 1.3em;">Lord of Belton<br>''sr will blount''</span>
<!-- No confusion. This is the grandson of William le Blount lord of Belton +1316 who married Isabelle de Beauchamp and adopted arms derived from them (They had three children). William here is the son of the more famous Thomas, Steward of the King's Household +1328 by his first wife (she's UI but died before 1325 since by then Thomas had then remarried w/ Juliana de Leybourne, widow of John de Hastings)  whose arms are rather well documented : a seal ref that I've found in Birch vol 2 : 7510 - Thomas le Blount - Temp. Edw. III - "a fess betw six martlets" - Legend "SIGILL THOME LE BLOUNT" and listed in several armorials of the same period (Parliamentary for ex) - I couldnt find a record a record of William's death but the branch most liklely ended up with him (He seemed to have no issue, in any case the manor obv. reverted to the main branch at some point after him or it's a remarkable coincidence and the two dynastic groups aren't related). Other Blounts in Dorset, Essex, Wilts etc (held Compton Valence & Kingston Blount) also used arms quite different from the main branch (Quarterly and bend ch. eagles). Among other less connected/documented Blount : 3 fleur de lis, a saltire engrailed (wilts) and three griffins passant (glos prob)  --><!-- That William (d.1315/16) was not lord of Belton but was actually the 2nd son of Robert Blount of Saxlingham/Saxlington whos sons Ralph obtained Belton. And 2nd of all the William you mention was the one from whom the Sodington branch was issued and that branch never used this arms. In fact neither Belton nor Sodington branch ever used this arms. The branch that changed their name to Croke was issued from Nicholas, 2nd son of Thomas Blount of Belton two generations later and he was the one who's descendants changed their name to "Croke" and used this arms...recorded in armorial registers. Again, it is obvious there is a confusion here, would be nice to solve it but seems almost impossible. I've looked into several sources and they all seem to contradict each other, best compilation of sources for Blount geneaology so far is at Sitrnet www.stirnet.com/genie/data/british/bb4fz/blount01.php -->
<-- That's an interesting link although just as full of uncertainty by essence. No doubt all these early modern era accounts are mostly flawed that's why I use them as little as possible (we're taught not to trust any of it here). In any case, in our present case it changes little (other than the political meaning behing the adoption of the design) if William isn't Thomas' father as the rest is attested from historical testimonies : Thomas +1328 who held Belton left two seals (the earliest being dated 1314) and is represented in several medieval rolls with those arms, confirming the tinctures. He's the one represented in the Parliamentary and Dunstable rolls and possibly most of the later copies (bc copies they are most of them, as always). My theory (and it is just that, as I can't spend more than a few hours on any single entry here, otherwise it would never be finished in the first place) is that two of his sons, Thomas and William are the ones represented in this roll (William) and on a 1341 seal (Thomas). In addition, there's another Thomas later (in the Styward roll which date isn't entirely certain I think -  but this is an occasional roll, not a compilation so another Thomas for sure) who could be the same Thomas son of Thomas again or even a third generation Thomas (depending if it's a 1348 roll as suggested by Greenstreet or a c. 1370 one as modern studies suggest now). In any case the Blounts certainly did use those arms in connection with Belton between 1314 and the 1350's at least, with one of them identified without doubt as Thomas, Steward +1328. Tbh I simply uploaded those arms with Belton Croke as the name because of the rules of no identical arms and kinda ancitipated that they would be deleted as duplicate afterwards if I didn't (since the later will go to the dynasty page and not the former), not because I know the exact relationship btw the various individuals having used them (but I don't believe for one second that this a coincidence or confusion : Burke & others simply couldn't know of any of those testimonies, let alone have them conveniently arranged in databases and so were missing important pieces of the puzzle). -->
 
PO380 Roger de Cuilly.svg|380. Roger de Cuilly<br><span style="font-size:88%; line-height: 1.3em;">Lord of Wilnecote<br>''sr roger quelly''</span>
PO380 Roger de Cuilly.svg|380. Roger de Cuilly<br><span style="font-size:88%; line-height: 1.3em;">Lord of Wilnecote<br>''sr roger quelly''</span>
PO381 William de Walkington.svg|381. William de Walkington<br><span style="font-size:88%; line-height: 1.3em;">Lord of Kirk Ireton, Wirksworth and Minsterworth<br>''sr will de walkynton''</span>
PO381 William de Walkington.svg|381. William de Walkington<br><span style="font-size:88%; line-height: 1.3em;">Lord of Kirk Ireton, Wirksworth and Minsterworth<br>''sr will de walkynton''</span>

Revision as of 20:49, 11 February 2021

The Powell Roll - c.1348 - WIP